uneven maintenance throttle - Page 2

George Villar · September 27th, 2012, 02:38 PM

I just got off the phone with Ducati Long Island's owner and master tech of 25+ years. He is also Desmosedici Certified (meaning he IS a wizard). Joe said that there is absolutely NO WAY that the factory Ducati DDS2 dealer tool allows anyone to adjust the ride by wire mapping tables. It is locked by the factory and that's all.

Just an FYI for all you fellow owners having the problem.

Best,

1198freak · September 27th, 2012, 03:14 PM

It is a known issue that the 1199 has and the 1198 before it had too. Not sure if the 999 before that had it. It is not entirely Ducati's fault, its not easy to get two big pistons to run smoothly under 5K RPM on a twin tuned like the 1199 is. The strict US emissions regs dont help either. But having said that, the riders body position can greatly affect throttle sensitivity. My 1199 has the slight surging issue at right around 5K, but its pretty slight so it doesn't really bother me.

kensteele · September 27th, 2012, 04:02 PM

took off from a light and just on the other side of the intersection, i hit a particular bumpy patch unexpectantly just at the right speed just as the throttle was acting up, too. almost threw me off the bike even though i was completely upright. learned my lesson, to pay more attention to....pretty much everything....always.

iamlance · September 27th, 2012, 04:05 PM

Mine was bad enough that when the surging and bucking gets going, would bang the "boys" against the tank. I got the race seat which helped with that issue. Rode 180 miles today. This bike really runs like shit. I hope Ducati comes up with a solution as I like everything else about the bike.

RSR racer · September 27th, 2012, 06:20 PM

FWIW, I had somewhat of a minor similar issue before the full Termi's and the up map. After that, things smoothed out considerably.

Easy solution IS TO RIP through that snarky part of the RPM band into what I like to call
"the fun zone" AKA 8000+ rpms at WOT

George Villar · September 27th, 2012, 07:13 PM

Agreed!

iamlance · September 27th, 2012, 07:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RSR racer

FWIW, I had somewhat of a minor similar issue before the full Termi's and the up map. After that, things smoothed out considerably.

Easy solution IS TO RIP through that snarky part of the RPM band into what I like to call
"the fun zone" AKA 8000+ rpms at WOT

Once in the fun riding places (Dutchess County) that works. Getting there is torture.

jamesz3 · October 2nd, 2012, 08:52 AM

There is a software update for some bikes - you have to have the dealer hookup your bike and it will list out the updates, if needed. Not much of an issue on the track since you're in the higher rpm ranges, but definitely a pain in the ass on the street.

DeltaIV · October 2nd, 2012, 10:21 PM

I've got the same behaviour at low speeds in 1st. I just move it into 2nd and that clears things up, I'm also thinking it has to do a little with the EBC in a high setting, so I might have a play and see how it reacts.

1st gear tight corners mainting the throttle is a no go for me especially after lights, get a better entry and just roll on the throttle and don't even think about even easing off. Don't need weight even fractionally coming back onto the front.

littlejohn · October 3rd, 2012, 01:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by noamkrief

Hey everyone. 3 week old ducati 1200 miles.

When I cruising around in 2nd gear 5-6000pm the throttle is very uneven. The bike sort of wants to go forward, and slow down. It's very jerky.
In 3rd gear it's less noticeable, and in 1st gear it's almost scary.

I tried today to see if the problem still exists at higher rpm. Took the bike to about 7k in 1st gear and the bike either wants to jump forward or slow down.

I haven't had this problem for the first 2 weeks since I've been cruising around at 3-4000 rpm range in 3rd gear mostly which this jerkiness is not noticeable.

When I do some "fun" riding around some back roads, corners in 2nd gear that require maintenance throttle at around 50mph are quite unnerving because the bike gets forward-aft imbalance due the the inability to maintain steady state speed.

I'm running 195Lo mode on the defaul sport setting.

Needless to say, my S1000RR and GSX-R600 don't suffer this issue whatsoever.

Thoughts?

PS - great bike but it's slow TURD up until 8000rpm where HOLLY CRAP it's fast!!! 5k RPM full open throttle in 3rd gear could use alot more torque. Getting the full termi system next week! Hopefully that will help.

Have you tried playing with the EBC? If not have a go setting it at 2.

TransNone13 · October 3rd, 2012, 05:36 AM

It is twitchy, but I like that... What gets me is the 5-6K drop with WOT. You can see it here: I absolutely HATE it, it feels like TC is kicking in or something. Most noticeable at the track. I think it's a combo of the mapping and throttle table.

Steve B · October 3rd, 2012, 05:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TransNone13

It is twitchy, but I like that... What gets me is the 5-6K drop with WOT. You can see it here: I absolutely HATE it, it feels like TC is kicking in or something. Most noticeable at the track. I think it's a combo of the mapping and throttle table.

I think as in the case with some of the reported handling "weave", some of the unsteady throttle response is rider-induced. With the weave thing, the wide bars make it really easy to cause a bit of twitch from uneven bar input, and likewise the super-light throttle spring makes it easy to move the throttle over normal road bumps without really intending to. I just run mine in 195Lo when I need smooth and steady light throttle response, like for cruising on the highway, or in traffic. Definitely switch to twitch mode when I get to the fun zone though...

Fueling does need some work though for sure as all the A/F charts from dyno runs have shown, and the first company that figures out how to get rid of the torque hole Transnone talks about has got my money. No excuse for an engine making less torque at 7K rpm than at 5K when then peak isn't until around 9K. The Pani's actually pretty solid from 3-5K, but then you have to cross death valley to get to the power. More linearity is in order.

TransNone13 · October 3rd, 2012, 07:54 AM

Yeah, I want an Akra EVO kit and a Bazzaz Fi-Module with AFM. If that doesn't work, I will bring it somehwere to get dynotuned. BMS here has the ability to tune it completely and is supporting an 1199 MRA rider this season.

jsgcb · October 3rd, 2012, 08:19 AM

i know that this might not be the case but i had a similar problem and thought it was in the throttle position sensor too. i did some more looking and found my throttle case had broke the alignment pin off the inside and my throttle case was moving slightly and making it horrible to ride. my dealer has since ordered me a new throttle case (waiting for it to come in) and then i will retest. just thought i would chime in.

noamkrief · October 4th, 2012, 05:39 PM

just got the new Termi full exhaust and headers put on my bike. Problem is gone. Also - heat issue is gone. I also got loads of power below 8000rpm and I can now take turns in 1st gear without being scared shitless because now the throttle response is smooth!!!!

oalvarez · February 16th, 2013, 05:22 AM

I'm glad I found this thread. Test rode a '13 Pani recently and noticed the same thing. If my memory serves me the jerkiness was around 4k-5k (2nd or 3rd?), regardless, I'd find that the only way to minimize it was to shift up a gear.

It's one of the few negatives I found in the bike.

E350 · February 16th, 2013, 06:13 AM

Regarding jerkiness, don't know if this is related but a combination of deactivating the flapper valve and getting the new ecu map has drastically reduced them throttle jerkiness. I also find riding in 195 hi is a lot lot smoother.

DR14 · February 16th, 2013, 07:53 AM

My bike is still this way even with the updated map, dealer said they would get it figured out once I can get up there weather wise. Rode my girlfriend's S back to back with mine and while the midrange of the older map is reduced, the initial throttle openings are more progressive on it. Guess it's time to start saving for Termi slip ons

DarioDuc · February 16th, 2013, 08:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lardawge

Only if you relinquish the snarky attitude.

^^ Woman

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September 27th, 2012, 02:38 PM	#21
George Villar Senior Member Joined: Jul 2012 From: New York City Posts: 427 Thanks: 68 I Ride: Ducati 1199 Tricolore S, 1199 Panigale ABS, Bimota Tesi2D,DB-7,DB1,etc. BMW alpha Racing s1000rr	I just got off the phone with Ducati Long Island's owner and master tech of 25+ years. He is also Desmosedici Certified (meaning he IS a wizard). Joe said that there is absolutely NO WAY that the factory Ducati DDS2 dealer tool allows anyone to adjust the ride by wire mapping tables. It is locked by the factory and that's all. Just an FYI for all you fellow owners having the problem. Best,

September 27th, 2012, 03:14 PM	#22
1198freak Senior Member Joined: Nov 2011 From: California Posts: 146 Thanks: 7	It is a known issue that the 1199 has and the 1198 before it had too. Not sure if the 999 before that had it. It is not entirely Ducati's fault, its not easy to get two big pistons to run smoothly under 5K RPM on a twin tuned like the 1199 is. The strict US emissions regs dont help either. But having said that, the riders body position can greatly affect throttle sensitivity. My 1199 has the slight surging issue at right around 5K, but its pretty slight so it doesn't really bother me.

September 27th, 2012, 04:02 PM	#23
kensteele Senior Member Joined: Jan 2012 From: Overland Park, KS Posts: 425 Thanks: 28	took off from a light and just on the other side of the intersection, i hit a particular bumpy patch unexpectantly just at the right speed just as the throttle was acting up, too. almost threw me off the bike even though i was completely upright. learned my lesson, to pay more attention to....pretty much everything....always.

September 27th, 2012, 04:05 PM	#24
iamlance Senior Member Joined: Aug 2012 From: connecticut Posts: 151 Thanks: 29	Mine was bad enough that when the surging and bucking gets going, would bang the "boys" against the tank. I got the race seat which helped with that issue. Rode 180 miles today. This bike really runs like shit. I hope Ducati comes up with a solution as I like everything else about the bike.

September 27th, 2012, 06:20 PM	#25
RSR racer Senior Member Joined: Jun 2012 From: Long Island, NY Posts: 764 Thanks: 104 I Ride: '13 Panigale R '12 1199S/ABS, '12 Multistrada S, '09 1098R Bayliss LE, 1998 custom rigid chopper	FWIW, I had somewhat of a minor similar issue before the full Termi's and the up map. After that, things smoothed out considerably. Easy solution IS TO RIP through that snarky part of the RPM band into what I like to call "the fun zone" AKA 8000+ rpms at WOT

September 27th, 2012, 07:13 PM	#26
George Villar Senior Member Joined: Jul 2012 From: New York City Posts: 427 Thanks: 68 I Ride: Ducati 1199 Tricolore S, 1199 Panigale ABS, Bimota Tesi2D,DB-7,DB1,etc. BMW alpha Racing s1000rr	Agreed!

October 2nd, 2012, 08:52 AM	#28
jamesz3 Junior Member Joined: Aug 2012 From: Brea, CA Posts: 14 Thanks: 0	There is a software update for some bikes - you have to have the dealer hookup your bike and it will list out the updates, if needed. Not much of an issue on the track since you're in the higher rpm ranges, but definitely a pain in the ass on the street.

October 2nd, 2012, 10:21 PM	#29
DeltaIV Senior Member Joined: Jan 2012 From: Australia Posts: 211 Thanks: 5	I've got the same behaviour at low speeds in 1st. I just move it into 2nd and that clears things up, I'm also thinking it has to do a little with the EBC in a high setting, so I might have a play and see how it reacts. 1st gear tight corners mainting the throttle is a no go for me especially after lights, get a better entry and just roll on the throttle and don't even think about even easing off. Don't need weight even fractionally coming back onto the front.

October 3rd, 2012, 05:36 AM	#31
TransNone13 Senior Member Joined: May 2012 From: Someville, Somestate Posts: 2,182 Thanks: 149	It is twitchy, but I like that... What gets me is the 5-6K drop with WOT. You can see it here: I absolutely HATE it, it feels like TC is kicking in or something. Most noticeable at the track. I think it's a combo of the mapping and throttle table.

October 3rd, 2012, 07:54 AM	#33
TransNone13 Senior Member Joined: May 2012 From: Someville, Somestate Posts: 2,182 Thanks: 149	Yeah, I want an Akra EVO kit and a Bazzaz Fi-Module with AFM. If that doesn't work, I will bring it somehwere to get dynotuned. BMS here has the ability to tune it completely and is supporting an 1199 MRA rider this season.

October 3rd, 2012, 08:19 AM	#34
jsgcb Senior Member Joined: Nov 2011 From: edmonton, alberta Posts: 188 Thanks: 8 I Ride: 2012 1199 Tri-colore	i know that this might not be the case but i had a similar problem and thought it was in the throttle position sensor too. i did some more looking and found my throttle case had broke the alignment pin off the inside and my throttle case was moving slightly and making it horrible to ride. my dealer has since ordered me a new throttle case (waiting for it to come in) and then i will retest. just thought i would chime in.

October 4th, 2012, 05:39 PM	#35
noamkrief Junior Member Joined: Sep 2012 From: Portland, OR Posts: 3 Thanks: 3	just got the new Termi full exhaust and headers put on my bike. Problem is gone. Also - heat issue is gone. I also got loads of power below 8000rpm and I can now take turns in 1st gear without being scared shitless because now the throttle response is smooth!!!!

February 16th, 2013, 05:22 AM	#36
oalvarez Senior Member Joined: Feb 2013 From: Los Angeles CA HWY 2 Posts: 316 Thanks: 60	I'm glad I found this thread. Test rode a '13 Pani recently and noticed the same thing. If my memory serves me the jerkiness was around 4k-5k (2nd or 3rd?), regardless, I'd find that the only way to minimize it was to shift up a gear. It's one of the few negatives I found in the bike.

February 16th, 2013, 06:13 AM	#37
E350 Senior Member Joined: Oct 2012 From: Frenchtown, nj Posts: 103 Thanks: 13 I Ride: Standard Panigale	Regarding jerkiness, don't know if this is related but a combination of deactivating the flapper valve and getting the new ecu map has drastically reduced them throttle jerkiness. I also find riding in 195 hi is a lot lot smoother.

February 16th, 2013, 07:53 AM	#38
DR14 Member Joined: Jun 2012 From: Brooklyn, NY Posts: 66 Thanks: 6 I Ride: 1199 Panigale S/ABS, Aprilia Tuono V4R APRC	My bike is still this way even with the updated map, dealer said they would get it figured out once I can get up there weather wise. Rode my girlfriend's S back to back with mine and while the midrange of the older map is reduced, the initial throttle openings are more progressive on it. Guess it's time to start saving for Termi slip ons